Anybody remember this book, I Kissed Dating Goodbye? I remember it very well. It was a very trendy evangelical book when I was in the Navigators and Campus Crusade back in 1998 and 1999. The basic thesis of the book is that dating is wrong, and that you shouldn’t even be alone with a member of the opposite sex until you are married. Thus, the author Joshua Harris distinguishes between dating, which is bad, and “courting,” which is good. The problem is that he doesn’t do a very good job of distinguishing between the two, and apparently he didn’t even follow his own advice, going on a “date” for bagels with the woman he is now married to. I wrote a fairly negative review of the book for Amazon.com, a review which just happens to be the first review most people see when they visit the book’s page on Amazon. I tried to be balanced in my review of the book, which I found superficial, and largely based on the personal negative dating experiences of the author.
My negative impression of the book developed because of what I witnessed before I ever read the book myself. It was all the rage in the evangelical circles I was a part of. You couldn’t go to any retreat, meeting, or whatever, without hearing about this book, and its philosophy, as if it really was the gospel. New converts to Christianity I knew often owned multiple copies of the book and would pass it out to anyone and everyone they met. People would go to dinner and a movie with someone of the opposite sex, but bend over backwards to call it anything but a “date,” because they had been taught, and believed, that “dating” is sinful. Of course, these new converts couldn’t tell you much about who Jesus was, or what he did for us, and hadn’t even begun to read the Bible, but they had the details of this book memorized. Perhaps I was cynical, but I often wondered how some people I knew could claim such sure knowledge of “biblical” love, without ever having opened a Bible.
My review on Amazon.com doesn’t mention this, but Harris’ attitude toward love strikes me as rather Gnostic-like. Even something as mild as holding hands was seen as violating “biblical” principles of courtship, so people I knew literally were getting married within months of meeting, because they craved any type of physical contact with that person (and I am not talking about sinful contacts, but simply holding hands or being alone outside of a group). It created an environment that essentially said “before marriage, no contact, after marriage, do whatever you want,” or at least that is how I heard it presented. I certainly agree that physical contact before marriage must be kept within certain boundaries of chastity, but to suggest that an unmarried couple cannot even spend time alone denies people important bonding time, including time to pray together.
My biggest gripe with the book, and the movement that followed, is not the basic underlying point, which is that the way secular society goes about finding love is very, very, screwed up. I can agree with this. My biggest complaint is the way that this book and movement dominated people’s lives, far surpassing virtually any other aspect of Christianity, including the Bible, basic doctrine, and social justice. New converts I knew learned nothing of the Trinity, helping the poor, Church history, the Bible, the person of Christ, etc, but became fully immersed in one 21-year old’s interpretation of “biblical” love, which was in reality based on a few proof-texts taken outside of any cultural context. “The Trinity? That’s boring. Let’s get back to Joshua Harris.” In other words, this method was the evangelical “flavor-of-the-day,” like the Prayer of Jabez was awhile back. I think following Harris’ principles is spiritually healthier than finding love the secular way, that is for sure, but the movement certainly had a “flavor-of-the-day” feel to it.
No matter what your opinion of Catholicism and Orthodoxy, we have a long and thoughtful tradition that is suspicious of flavor-of-the-day type movements. This is one thing that drew me to both of these Traditions. What I read of Catholic and Orthodox authors (including the Fathers) was far more deep, thoughtful, and enduring than the “flavor-of-the-day” stuff I was often exposed to as an evangelical. Granted, many evangelicals themselves criticize this tendency among some of their brethren, so I am not saying that evangelical=flavor-of-the-day, but many secondhand stores are littered with yesterdays’ “flashes-in-the-pan.”
August 2, 2008 at 10:29 am |
I recall hearing an interview with the author a decade ago on the radio.
Many of his points about casual dating were (I seem to recall) rather well informed… but like so many Evangelical authors it didn’t seem to be grounded in the spiritual so much as the pragmatic. The proof-texting he offered seemed to only highlight this.
I recall similarly an author on “How Christians Can Make Marriage Work” (or some such title) opining that Christian couples should NOT even attempt to have a house built until they are in their tenth year of marriage – the rationale being that it was too stressful… The advice seemed somewhat sound according to certain schools of thought, but what it had to do with discipleship, or what made that nugget of wisdom particularly “Christian” escaped me… Again, pragmatic advice…
At the end of the day I think the problem in a lot of these books from a Catholic standpoint is a failure to grasp and appreciate the reality of Christ’s sacramental Church, how marriage is a sacrament and what the end goal of it is.
August 2, 2008 at 11:58 am |
Heck yeah, I remember this book. We probably still have a copy, and the follow-up book at our hosue. I remember thinking it was pretty poor when I read it and I was allergic to anything I thought “legalistic” (and maybe rightly so, since none of came from legitimate authority).
At the time, most of the Christians I knew thought he had some points, but few thought that “courting” was necessarilly the answer. My future wife always appreciated the works of Elizabeth Elliot (”Passion & Purity”, etc.) much more. I’ll have to ask her how it is different and/or better.
Looking back, I realize how weak so many of these types of books are. Yes, even the ones everyone considers “solid” and “biblical”. Wish I could go back in time and recommend to myself that I read some Pieper, Ratzinger, etc. instead of this kind of adhoc and provincial evangelical schlock.
August 2, 2008 at 12:45 pm |
I was going to mention Elisabeth Elliot, actually. At an evangelical college (I was there 1996-1999), I kissed dating goodbye was everywhere but because we were a missions oriented college, Elisabeth Elliot was also highly popular, especially among women. I was hesitant to read any of it because I thought the whole conversation was simplistic and I saw people all around me getting engaged because they wanted to hold hands and it seemed pretty misguided. Eventually, I did read Elliot and I liked to the book. She’s writing about her own experience, so it comes across in a very authentic way. She certainly sets herself up as a role model but that’s a far cry from “let me tell you a series of simplistic principles that sum up everything in the world!” I also really appreciated that she and her husband were friends. They were the best of friends. Their evolution into a couple was innocent and pure and chaste and everything else a christian romance should be but it wasn’t a pair of total strangers rushing their relationship so as to avoid “dating.”
That said, she does advocate courtship and stands by the principle of no physical contact before marriage (e.g. hand holding). I have mixed feelings about that.
August 3, 2008 at 12:52 am |
Well Chad, you are here now… and that is what counts.
Honestly, there is, I wager, a great deal of Providence in the fact you had some lean years and were exposed to all of this. It gives you what you need to speak to it, as you are familiar with it.
So I wouldn’t look back with regret on those years or the hours spent reading such. It has helped you to understand the Evangelical mind better. That does and will count for something in your travels.
August 3, 2008 at 7:39 am |
From a personal point of view: I remember the book as a (then) 20’s single evangelical, surrounded by hundreds of other 20’s single evangelicals women (where were the men?). I saw a picture of Joshua Harris and I thought at the time, “He’s good looking, lives in the South, works for a Christian publishing company, goes to church. This man is not going to be single for long. (I rather resented him.) It’s going to be easy pickings for him and now I’ll have to deal with the few men who came to church who now think dating is a sin. GREAT!” Well, now I’m catholic and married. So it all worked out. :)
August 3, 2008 at 1:28 pm |
I actually have a blog written about the book and its concepts.
My take on it was that it was more of a fad then something that lasted in most Christian Circles. There will always be some groups that promote it. Look on a few used bookseller sites and last I looked you could buy a copy of it for $1.00 plus postage. What does that tell you.
Unfortunately, Harris didn’t share the problems with his approach that the church he now pastors had years of experience with before he wrote the book. I comment on a lot of this on my blog.
I also get the impression that Harris really doesn’t feel the need to try and straighten out the legalistic approach a lot of people have done with his book. He popularized this concept and significantly created to the mess he created but now has other things to do than spend his time working to straighten this out. Fortunately, what he wrote in his book isn’t the “gospel” in most circles.
http://www.ikdg.wordpress.com
“I Kissed Dating Goodbye: Wisdom or Foolishness?”
August 3, 2008 at 5:55 pm |
LOL!!! I bought the book a few years ago. As a Catholic. As a Catholic mom with (now) teenage boys. I had no idea it was this huge evangelical fad. None whatsoever. I haven’t read it yet and neither have my sons. After seeing this thread, I guess I won’t recommend it to them.
August 3, 2008 at 6:09 pm |
diane
IMO, the book has more application to teenagers than anyone else. Harris doesn’t make that distinction but was written at 21 which be mostly his teeenage years.
The doing things in groups that Harris recommends might be a good way for teenagers to start out but even with that there can be exceptions to when it doesn’t apply.
August 3, 2008 at 7:07 pm |
Steve Wood is a former protestant pastor who seems to be a kind of Catholic James Dobson and promotes courtship. Anybody read this one? :)
http://www.familylifecenter.net/cart/product_detail.cfm?ID=620
August 5, 2008 at 10:58 am |
Engaged Orthodox Jews don’t touch each other until the wedding adn they seem to do alright.
August 5, 2008 at 11:29 am |
Please, don’t compare IKDG to the Prayer of Jabez. IKDG may be reactionary, may be flavor of the month, but it’s quite useful for alot of people. It’s not the book’s fault if it’s taken wrongly or taken too far (to the point of being obsessive) by its readers. Nor is it the book’s fault that it got really popular.
But physical contact is not necessary before marriage, you know? Harris calls you to sanctify your romantic life rather than just to follow the secular world. It could be alot worse, you know.
August 6, 2008 at 10:23 am |
My wife and I would have burned so, we married. God is good.
November 27, 2008 at 5:07 pm |
Rhology
I wouldn’t say that the author or the book are blameless with regard to people misapplying the book etc.
Josh Harris only mentioned all the pros about his approach. He failed to share the historic problems that have happened with it. This is like a salesman who only tell the pros or his product and not its cons. Why people ran with this without qustioning for a period is still beyond me and they certainly are to blame but that doesn’t mean Harris can deny any complicity with this.
Blog Owner(s)
Can someone from the blog email. I would like to see if I can share some of this on my blog critiquing the book.
ikdgnot at yahoo
Thanks
December 1, 2008 at 8:38 pm |
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